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Without Code & Adobe Muse End of Life: Your Most Commonly Asked Questions

We’ve received a hugely positive response to our new business direction announcement – thank you for all your support!

Rather than replying to each email and post individually, we thought it made more sense to collect all of your questions and post the answers here for all to see.

We’ve split the questions up into two categories – those relating to Muse end of life and those to Without Code. I’m sure everyone is exhausted from all of the chaos in our world right now, so I’ll write these responses in a fast and transparent way.

Please note also there is quite a bit of incorrect information and several assumptions floating around in the community. Many users who do not work for our company and have no inside knowledge of our plans are spreading news and responding to questions with the wrong answers. We would just like to point out that unless information about our business and future plans comes directly from a MuseThemes team member, it’s best not to take it as the truth.

We also need to let you know that some of the information is subject to change. We’re still finalizing various aspects of our new platform, and we can only share this information with the understanding that there are many decisions to be made and aspects to finalize.

*NOTE - the Without Code website and builder is live! Check out our new site creation tools today: www.wocode.com

Let’s do this!

 

Muse Questions: 

 

What is happening to MuseThemes? Are you shutting down or will you take care of us? Will you stop selling memberships?

MuseThemes will continue to build new products for Muse as long as it’s viable. Our existing products will receive the same level of support as we’ve always given them. 

Muse is not going away tomorrow, and users shouldn’t rush into another platform without proper time and consideration. We are not shutting down, and we are not going to stop selling memberships.

Our core business is based on Adobe Muse – we employ a full-time staff of 12 people supporting over 100,000 customers. We’re going to support our Muse users as long as we possibly can, in addition to building a new path forward for both us and them. One day we know we’ll look back fondly at Muse as the catalyst that started it all. 

 

If I am currently working on Muse sites do you suggest I stick with Muse or switch to a new platform right away?

There’s nothing wrong with finishing your site build in Muse, or maintaining existing sites in Muse. If it was good enough for your website build two days ago, it’s still good enough today. It will likely be many years before Muse websites don’t work properly in modern browsers.

The Muse shutdown simply means Muse has reached its final state – and it’s in a pretty good state. The application is not “time-bombed” meaning unless you delete Muse it will stay on your computer forever. There is no need to rush or panic. 

The only time sensitive element of the Muse end of life is if you’ve hosted a website on Business Catalyst’s servers. If that’s the case, you’ll need to move it to another hosting platform within the next two years (prior to May 2020).

 

Do you have a suggestion for hosting platforms with BC going away?

We have internal sites hosted with various companies, including HostGator, GoDaddy, Media Temple, and Amazon Web Services. The truth is they all load quickly and our sites perform in a very comparable way. Unless you’re doing millions of visits, I would base my hosting decision off stability of the host, features of the hosting platform, and price.

 

Will you help convert Muse sites to other Adobe platforms like Dreamweaver? 

Dreamweaver is primarily used as a code editing tool for websites. So technically a conversion would be to simply export your Muse websites as HTML, and open those files in Dreamweaver.

We do not recommend Dreamweaver as a replacement for Muse. It’s built for developers and doesn’t seem to get much love and attention from Adobe from what we’ve seen at conferences.

 

What are your thoughts on Adobe's potential replacement products: XD, Portfolio, or Spark? 

None of these products offer the functionality of Muse, and they are not suitable replacements for Muse in their current states. This may change down the road depending on Adobe’s development plans for these applications.

XD is a prototyping tool that would show major promise if designs could be exported as complete websites (HTML / CSS). Working in XD is a very enjoyable and streamlined design experience, but the final design would need to be passed on to a developer for coding.

Portfolio and Spark are cloud apps that are easy to use, however, they build websites that are very static and basic compared to Muse.

There are rumors going around in the community about a new version of Spark coming out soon that will fill the Muse void. Our Adobe NDA restricts us from commenting, however, most of what we’ve been reading looks very fictitious.

 

What will happen to Muse in-browser editing after May 2019? 

In-Browser Editing (IBE) on Business Catalyst hosted sites will go away when that hosting service is de-commissioned on March 26, 2020.

Any Muse-generated site on third party hosting platforms will remain edible with IBE as long as there are no browser incompatibilities (which could be several years).

 

Can you buy Muse from Adobe, and continue on development?

While we’re flattered you think this highly of us, unfortunately this isn’t possible. Adobe would likely never sell an app they built using their own proprietary code and technology, and we wouldn’t have a software team large enough to continue development. If they were willing to sell, the cost would likely be extremely high.

 

Can I have a refund for the remaining days of my MuseThemes membership?

At this time, we’re not issuing partial refunds for memberships that are beyond our 14-day satisfaction guarantee. We will fulfill our commitment to you to produce and support Adobe Muse products for the foreseeable future. If you have a question about your account or a cancellation, please send us a note to accounts@musethemes.com.

 

How can I download and backup the Muse installer as you suggested in your blog post? 

Muse will still be available to install from the Creative Cloud application until May 2018. After that date, you will be able to download the installer file from Adobe. Details from Adobe are still to come.

 

Why did Adobe decide to shutdown Muse? Why won’t they bring it back? 

I suspect only the executives at Adobe know the real answer. Adobe is a big, publicly traded company, with lots of very popular products like Photoshop and InDesign. Muse, in comparison to those products, is very small and if the ongoing costs to support the app were exceeding the volume of users it brought into the Creative Cloud offering, it might have just been a numbers decision.

Users are obviously very upset (as are we), however, this decision was probably made long ago after much thought. The damage is already done, and reversing their decision isn’t going to help their Creative Cloud signups, or their reputation, no matter what. Anything can happen, but I wouldn’t hold your breath for a change of heart.

 

 

Without Code Questions:

 

When is Without Code launching? 

There is obvious demand for a new product, and we’re working around the clock to deliver our new products. We hope to get users working within Architect and Engineer within a few weeks, or sooner if it’s ready. We recognize the urgency and are doing everything we can to make it happen.

With that said, we may need to limit or restrict some features initially to deliver it faster than anticipated. Muse was built over the course of 10 years (two of those behind the scenes prior to a public beta), so we have to properly manage expectations and under promise / over deliver.

  

What are your Without Code products: Architect and Engineer?

Architect is an online responsive website creation system. You can use it to create feature rich sites from scratch, or using a template. Without Code can provide you with custom widgets (similar to what we have done for MuseThemes) to integrate new functionality. We have leveraged an existing website creation system as our core platform, and signed an enterprise agreement with them. 

Engineer is a content management system for any platform. You can build a gallery in Engineer, and embed that gallery in any platform – Wordpress, Shopify, Webflow, Muse, etc. Once you’ve built the gallery, you can give your clients the ability to edit the content. If your client moves their site to another platform – let’s say away from Muse and into something new – they can continue to edit it in the same way they always have. Platform freedom and independence were the core goals driving Engineer. This product was built from the ground up by the MuseThemes team, and designed to meet your specific needs.

In addition to these products, we have plans to provide themes and training for other web design platforms to ensure you are selecting the proper one for your business.

 

Are Architect and Engineer hosted (web) applications, or desktop applications like Muse? 

Architect and Engineer are hosted, web-based applications. I know this will disappoint many of you, however let me explain why we believe this is the best route.

Most modern technology companies have moved to cloud-based applications, because of the ease of scaling and stability. Rather than spending time bug-fixing apps and improving stability for various operating systems – years of Windows and Mac OSX versions – companies can build one single web-based application that works perfectly in them all, and more resources can be spent on new feature development. This was a huge liability for Muse, and we often waited 12 months for a new release that only contained “stability and performance fixes.” 

The application is also available no matter where you’re working, on any computer / device, and is always up to date. We can build widgets for Architect and they will be available in your account immediately, rather than having to prompt you to download them and update your app. Bugs can be fixed across the entire platform with one quick update. The benefits go on and on, which is why you’re seeing so many companies building their products this way.

 

Can Architect and Engineer be used offline? 

No. An internet connection is required to use our products.

 

Why didn’t you build a desktop application to replace Muse? Why did you partner with an existing website creation platform? 

Applications of any kind are a very big undertaking from both a cost and time perspective. It took Muse nearly 10 years to get to this point, and that’s built by a billion-dollar software corporation. Most software start-ups take on venture funding to support their growth prior to being profitable. Squarespace, for example, has raised nearly 300 million dollars in funding (https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/squarespace#section-overview).

For us to build a feature-rich website creation app on the side (while still supporting MuseThemes) was just not feasible. That would require a large engineering team, along with dedication and years of focus – not to mention higher prices to recoup venture funding. 

By partnering with an existing platform that we’ve vetted and formed a great relationship with, we can leave the heavy lifting to them and build our community’s most-requested features on top. This platform has a very large engineering team (bigger than Muse had at its end of life) and millions of dollars in funding. It’s also been used to build millions of websites.

 

Can we export our sites, and host them anywhere? 

This is an area we are still working on. The platform Architect is built on does support site export, but in a feature limited way. What this means is that you could export out static / simple sites for hosting elsewhere, however, for advanced functionality such as CMS editing, blogging or ecommerce, you will need to host with us.

This is standard across any online website creation tool. Blogs and ecommerce systems are usually uniquely integrated with their hosting service, and are not inherently portable, as static content is. Think of the hosting behind a site as the foundation and land that your home is built on. If you want the ability to move your home around frequently and quickly, you’re going to be very limited in what kind of features you can have in that home – and it’s probably going to have wheels. 

Hosting is also a major profit center for any website creation system. There’s a reason that there are very few desktop / standalone website builders on the market (and likely part of the reason why Muse is going away) – it’s tough to be financially viable by charging a one-time fee for software that’s potentially used to make 1000’s of websites.

Export in Architect is also a relatively new feature, and we still need to evaluate the flexibility of exported sites and the cost to export them. We know this is a very important feature for you, so we’ll ensure we give it the appropriate priority (it’s top of the list currently).

 

I recognize the core platform Architect is built on – why shouldn’t I just go direct to them? 

As a large membership site with a huge volume of customers, we can negotiate rates and features that most other companies can’t.

If you recognize our core platform and go directly to them, that’s completely fine. However, you’re probably going to pay more than you would through Without Code, and you won’t have access to any of our custom integrations, widgets, themes, and training. If your account isn’t setup through Without Code, there is currently no way to transfer those products to you. Widgets are not portable like Muse for download and install. 

Essentially you will pay more, to get a lot less.

We’re not hiding the fact that our platform exists outside of Architect, however, we’re not advertising it either. Partnering with a big, reputable company is a very positive aspect of our new business, and we’re proud of it. However, we do need to ensure users signup through our channels, or else we have no way to help those users succeed with the platform.

 

Why should I use Architect vs. other solutions like Webflow?

There are lots of great products on the web, and we encourage you to explore them all and determine what’s best for your clients and business.

When we started looking at other solutions outside of Muse, we paid close attention to two important aspects: the learning curve to transition to another app, and the speed of website creation. Architect is a wonderful balance of site flexibility and features, paired with quick build times and easy adoption. We were able to rebuild several of our Muse templates in about 1/10th of the time, with minimal up-front training. Since many users are planning to rebuild their Muse sites in another app, it's important that sites can be created very quickly.

Our experience with Webflow is that it is very powerful, and full of great features; several of our core team members use it often. However, we also felt that it took a long time to learn and feel comfortable in. Many of these apps fall a little closer to the developer end of the spectrum, using terms like box model, floats, and divs in their marketing materials. Most advertise they are ways to “code visually.” That’s fine for designers who have some understanding of code, but it’s a foreign language to designers who just need visual layout and site generation.

 

Can Architect do everything that Muse can do? 

No, it can’t. However, it can do several things that Muse can’t do. Once users get started with Architect and identify any gaps in functionality, we’ll work to fill those gaps as quickly as we can.

Just like Muse, there will be things we need to add and improve over time to add functionality. Nothing will fit your needs perfectly right out of the gate, but our entire business revolves around making sure we add the features you need. It’s our number one priority.

 

Can I transfer or migrate sites from Muse right into Architect? 

There is no automatic migration from Muse, and no platform will be able to offer that. The site structure that Muse generated was very complex, and no platform will be able to pull it in and build a full site.

With that said, Architect does have “content collection” tools available to help streamline the transition. In our experience, recreating Muse sites in Architect has been a very quick and enjoyable process. 

We’re also exploring the idea of creating a directory of migration partners who could help you move your site over. This could be a great opportunity for designers to master our platform, and take on projects rebuilding Muse sites in Architect. If this is of interest to you, please send us a note to info@wocode.com mentioning our partner program.

 

How much will Without Code cost? 

Without Code is structured with a few pricing plans for various levels of features.

  • Free accounts will have feature-limited access to Architect, with standard rates if you decide to host with us.
  • Premium or “VIP” memberships will have full access to Architect, in addition to Engineer, and all of our product updates, new releases, training and design resources. You will receive preferred hosting rates (including an SSL certificate), which are very competitive and leave plenty of room for you to markup and charge back to your clients. You will also receive full access to MuseThemes and all Muse-related widgets, themes and training.
  • We’re also exploring an Enterprise plan, that would give you white labelling features, along with exclusive community resources, front of the line support, and direct access to our team.

While we’re still finalizing our plans and pricing, the cost will most likely be billed annually in a similar fashion to MuseThemes. Prices will be comparable to what you paid for your MuseThemes membership. 

If you are paying for a Without Code membership, you will not need to pay for a MuseThemes membership as well. Without Code VIP’s get access to both sites under one membership.

 

Do existing MuseThemes members get a discount or incentive for Without Code?

Absolutely. We want to reward users who have supported us over the years, and always have by grandfathering in our pricing. Our ideal scenario is we transition you into Without Code, with very little interruption in our billing cycles. This is not an opportunity for us to charge you more or try to make more money, it’s about avoiding interruption in your business and smoothly transitioning ours to a new direction.

Discount levels are still being finalized, however, we would like to avoid having every individual customer at a unique pricing level. We will likely establish a few pricing tiers, and the length and price of your MuseThemes membership will establish which tier you fall into. 

We also encourage you to maintain your existing MT membership. Active members will qualify for different pricing than former / cancelled members, so try not to jump ship until you have enough information to make an informed decision.

 

How does the Adobe Muse end of life announcement impact Without Code? 

Well it’s certainly going to help us drive business to Without Code and get users on our platform. We would have liked a little more notice though, perhaps just a few months to get prepared.

 

Is Architect going to be part of Creative Cloud? 

Over the years we often received questions about our connection to Adobe. Users assumed we were affiliated with Adobe because of our name.

Architect and Without Code is in no way affiliated with Adobe, and we’re not part of the Creative Cloud.

  

Are all of your MuseThemes widgets going to be available in Architect and Engineer? 

No. We have to manually rebuild all of our products in Architect, which is a good opportunity for us to be selective and prioritize your needs. We will work quickly to add widgets that are highly popular on MuseThemes, and we’ll give you a channel to voice your needs directly to our team.

Existing MuseThemes widgets will not work in Architect since the development format is completely different.

 

Does Architect feature a Content Management System for my clients? 

Yes! Content management was a major priority for us, and we’re happy to say your clients can have either full or limited editing access to make site updates, depending on your needs. Our final release of Architect will be unbranded, so that your clients won’t be able to trace the CMS back to our company.

Engineer is also a tool that can be utilized to give clients access to specific components in a website, no matter what platform that site is built on.

 

Will you create templates for Architect, or other web design products? 

Yes! We’ve already started creating themes for Architect, along with a big library that comes default with the product. Architect also uses “sections,” which are similar to MuseThemes’ Stacks in Adobe Muse. Pre-built content blocks that can be dropped into place and quickly customized for fast site creation.

Without Code also has plans to provide themes and training for other web design platforms. Architect is our core focus initially, however, in the spirit of sharing the best tools available for code-free design, we do want to expose our members to alternative systems that may work better for their client needs.

 

Does Architect export perfectly clean, semantic code? 

The code behind Architect is much better than Muse, however, it’s not as clean as a developer would write by hand. Code clarity should only matter to you in two situations: you’re experiencing slow websites due to code bloat, or you plan to edit the code manually later on.

In our speed test comparisons of Architect vs. other platforms, it was the top performer in every test we ran. By default, Architect sites are optimized to pass Google page speed requirements. Images are automatically optimized and reduced for optimum load time. 

The code behind Architect sites is available for editing directly in the editor interface. It might not look as pretty as the code behind other developer focused website builders, however, it loads faster and ranks the same or better from an SEO perspective.

 

Are Architect sites fully responsive? 

Yes. Architect sites are an responsive / adaptive hybrid model, and are beautifully optimized for all devices.

Architect uses a different (and superior) responsive system than Muse did. By using device detection on the server side, Architect sites can display the same site to a mobile user with highly optimized assets. Think of this as a blend between alternate layout and responsive in Muse. You have the power to tweak various site elements for mobile / tablet layouts, however, you don’t have to maintain completely different websites.

 

Feature specific questions – does it have? 

Blogging – yes, default feature. 

CSS Animations – yes, default feature. Includes parallax scrolling for images.

Ecommerce – yes, default feature with a huge list of payment providers. Requires an upgraded pricing plan for larger stores.

Embedded HTML – yes, default feature. Insert anything you did in Muse using embed code. 

Forms – yes, default feature. Includes dropdowns, radio buttons, and entry fields. Your form submissions will actually arrive in your email too (sorry Muse forms, but it’s true).

iFrames – yes, through a Without Code widget or embedded code. 

Image upload / editing – yes, site assets can be bulk uploaded, managed within the editor, and even modified within the app. The asset management system is far superior to Muse.

Language Support – yes, default feature. 

Login pages / database features / membership sites – not available out of the box. Possibility for later addition through Without Code widgets, or using our Engineer CMS.

Overlapping elements – yes, but there are limitations. You need to respect the grid (row and column) structure to ensure beautiful responsiveness. 

Webfonts – yes, default feature. Additional fonts could be added through a Without Code integration widget (Typekit, Google Fonts, etc.)

YouTube, Facebook and social widgets – yes, default feature. Also available through embedded code or custom widgets.

 

What makes Architect stand out from other web design platforms?

Here are my favorite aspects of Architect, and what I think makes it stand above the rest: 

  • You can build sites very quickly. After working in Muse, Architect is a very streamlined and enjoyable experience. It’s almost impossible to completely "break" a site in Architect, because of the grid system.
  • Custom widgets are stable and powerful. We can fix bugs or issues quickly and update widgets across our entire platform in a single click.
  • Low learning curve, easy adoption. While not as simple as mass commercial builders like Wix, it’s also nowhere near as complex as the developer-oriented tools like Pinegrow and Webflow. We will also provide extensive training as we always did with MuseThemes products.
  • The platform is complete business tool. You can build and manage multiple sites from a single interface. Costs can easily be billed back to clients as part of your design quote / agreement. It’s a tool that enables you to make more money and grow your business to the next level.

 

Phew! Thanks for reading. If you have any other questions, please drop us a line or comment below and we will add them to the list. 

Cheers,
Steve

Steve Harris
Steve Harris / Calgary, Canada

Steve Harris started MuseThemes in 2011 and steadily grew the company, going from a full-time corporate employee to being his own boss. More than just MuseThemes, Steve is a conference speaker, Lynda.com author, and holds equally large collections of both business books and fine scotch.

Comments

Cathie George
Cathie George

Thanks for such a comprehensive explanation. On Monday there were so many questions, so much anger and uncertainty. Having had time to digest what this week’s news has meant, has given me the opportunity to look at how I work and make some rather big changes. Every cloud has a silver lining, some more than others. The possibility of WOCode is exciting and I’m looking forward to ditching Muse to move to your new platform. I’ve already investigated other options for all my other Adobe products and am equally excited about moving to Affinity & back to Quark. It’s going to be a huge learning curve, but hopefully a worthwhile and exciting one. Cheers!

Phil
Phil

Thank you MT! You guys rock. Looking forward to the next update.

Pierre Cornelissen
Pierre Cornelissen

Thanks is million for the answers – it soothes in a way the nerves.

My biggest concern is the lack of off-line development. I have clients in rural areas and farms with very slow or no internet connections but the client need to have a website for their business. I then develop the prototype website “on-site” using a laptop and complete at home on my desktop. My other concern is: I work in an environment where the internet connection is very sporadic. It drops at least one or two times a day, somtimes a full day or more. What will happen to my design if this happens? How does the “Save As” work – I use it with every little change in all development and office apps I use? How do I do backups such as creating a copy of the existing design and rename it with a date e.g. mysite.muse-20180329? I use it quite a lot if I want to do a bit of sand-boxing. How do I port my development/design to a safe place such as OneDrive, DropBox or GoogleDrive – my development files repositories? As an example, in Muse I developed quite a lot of Google Maps code in Notepad++, tested and copied the core javascript code to Muse. Will this option be available too, to do my own javascript functions? You mentioned Wix, an awefull development interface to work with. Muse was quite easy to use; it does have it’s quirks too. Please have a KISS approach – an excellent UX. I have used in my old Joomla days Artisteer and later touched Themler – also not the best UI.

As a 33+ year systems developer/integrator, C# front-end and MS-SQL, a secure development environment is quite important. I presume you will have such a secure and stable platform and will have backups. If the paw-paw hits the fan in terms of messing up my design, is there a way to fall back on an earlier design – hence the request of creating a copy as mentioned above.

I have a myriad of other questions, but will keep it for a later moment.

Tx a mil and wish you guys all the best in this endeavour.

Pierre

Gavin Davies
Gavin Davies

Hi Steve, big fan of your work and well-written article thanks for the update. I have played with Webflow and for me, Web did not flow (lol) the learning curve is steep and takes the design element out of designer as you might have guessed I am a designer, not a coder Can this used on an iPad from within a browser? and is there any preview option or just preview in a browser? We seem to be in a bit of a black hole with news about the new system could you post sneak peaks of elements of the new system on a regular basis to wet the appetite prior to launch.

Marc Elias
Marc Elias

Great article, thanks for laying everything out and keeping us excited for the future!

Erik
Erik

The flexibility to ftp/upload web site. I have my own server and I would like to upload over there and not via your hosting plan. Is that possible? or will be?
What about integration with shopping carts (third party). Will be any connection?

Keep the good job!

Paul Chapple
Paul Chapple

I am “coding challenged” and as result I’ve progressed through a series of “code-free” apps. I started with an early version of “FrontPage” then on to “Expression Web” and later to “SiteGrinder”. I was delighted when Muse came along as SiteGrinder was folding. As a very senior Senior Citizen (very) I knew my web design days were numbered. In reality I have only built one working site with Muse. I did plan to build a replacement for my old clunky site but got involved in a small voluntary project that is my last functioning site. I built (not very skillfully!) the site: www.TennisWalden.com for the Tennis Program of a country club where I was a member. The site is hosted free of charge by Business Catalyst and I personally cover all the other costs. I’d like to continue updating the site as long as I am physically able.. When I stop the site will no longer exist. Much as I would have liked to I couldn’t justify the cost of Muse Themes.

If I was still in the web design business I would be an active member/user of Muse Themes. I would have been ab active member/user of the many great designs and features Muse Themes offers. Good luck with the transition to a Muse-free world and great success with your own new venture(s).

Eva
Eva

Hi, thank you for the optimistic info and good luck with your plans :) How about he care + protection service concerning W/O – is there constant maintenance necessary like with Wordpress? Thx.

Steve Lasko
Steve Lasko

Thank you, Steve. I appreciate your forthright approach. I was contemplating Webflow, but now I think I’ll transition to Architect. I have great faith in the future success of W/O Code!

erin P
erin P

I second Chuck Brannan’s comment. My one site grew and evolved with Muse and BC as the needs of the non profit I work for did. While taking several online courses in coding has been insightful, it was not enough to build, alter and maintain my site as produced in Adobe Muse. I am forever grateful to the Apple employee who pointed me in the direction of Muse back in 2011.

Miguel Guinard
Miguel Guinard

Steve,

I like the way you run your business. Thank you for taking care of us. Looking forward to the switch and the ability to have a blog feature built in without a third party. I hope Adobe comes up with a smaller creative cloud package. One of the features that kept me paying the full amount was the free hosting for 10 websites. Without muse the $50 a month is loosing value.

Nathan
Nathan

This all is great! But there’s only one massive problem: being forced to work online only. That won’t work for all of us ex-Musers. Also I’ve never really enjoyed web based apps. They just don’t deliver as smooth of an experience. Regardless, Cheers MT! You guys are always doing a fantastic job. Thank you! This FAQ was exactly what was needed.

Jay
Jay

Thanks for providing clear and honest answers to the above questions. Your widgets and training videos have been the essential for my ability to build websites for my church and personally. If the pricing is comparable with MT, then I can hardly wait to sign up and transition over to without code.
Cheers,
Jay

Julian
Julian

It all sounds great but my only concern, which I think could be a big limitation, is designing to a fixed grid and not being able to overlay elements. The ability to do this in Muse was one of the major reasons I use Muse. Will there ever be an opportunity to override the grid?

Jud Blakely
Jud Blakely

The article is clear and reassuring for me…but then, I don’t make a living from the design of websites and, thus, don’t have a career and a reputation to protect.

My thought is…if you can combine the best aspects of Webflow with the best aspects of Muse, then you have a killer piece of software on your hands…and that’s kind of what I sense when you allude to your “foundational” partner in the WithoutCode venture . I can’t manipulate the Webflow UI with the boxes within boxes within boxes options that create the structure that all the content and actions fit into. Wish I could but I keep failing to grant myself said wish.

At any rate, I’m going to “re-subscribe” to MuseThemes in order to affirm how grateful I am for what I infer WithoutCode will be. I prefer a Muse-like blank canvas that allows me to create and build with electronic “brushes.”

Keep in mind that people like me are not consequential in growing your business. Even so…people like me will share my inclination to give WithoutCode a try. Thanks again for daring to go big with web design.

Jud Blakely
Mobile, Alabama

Matt
Matt

This sound great – thanks so much for taking the time to develop W/O Code!

Just one question – will you support Ecwid?

I’m using your Ecwid widget at the moment in Muse – but have over 150 products and would rather not have to rebuild the shop!!

Thanks again though – I can’t wait for the release :)

Jeannette
Jeannette

Hi Steve,

Most of this sounds very good. There are a few points I’d like to touch on though:

1) Hosting. Please recognize that I, like many others, provide hosting to my clients through an outside server. I have a plan for unlimited numbers of sites so when I add more my profits just go up. I DO NOT want a 2nd plan for hosting sites. This is very important to my business, to be able to export the site to load up and run off of the server service that I use.

2) You mentioned that it’s hard to be profitable just selling a software program that people can use to make as many sites as they want. Not so. Look at all these examples: InDesign, Illustrator, Photoshop, Word, PP, etc, etc…. They certainly have made bundles of money and have to rights to or profits coming from how many brochures, images, logos, etc. that we make. We ALL have to be able to make money and not just the big companies. Please don’t get greedy here and leave room for us designers to make some of the money too.

3) You mention that no company will be able to bring in a complete Muse file. Actually Pinegrow does (I did it with their trial version). It’s not likely to be the program I want to use as I want a visual design program and Pinegrow is very codie but they are able to bring in and allow complete editing. Just saying, please look into this as a feature more as it would be great to have a converter for the Muse files coming in…

I have been a Muse-Themes user for a while and love everything you’ve done! Hoping you can work out these last few things to help us musers move forward.

Thank you!

Lisa
Lisa

Hi Steve, thanks for writing this very informative Q & A. One concern I have is that you said that WO Code will be accessed only via the Internet. What happens if someone is in the middle of creating or editing a site and loses Internet? This happens all too often in my area. The benefit of downloading Muse is that we are able to work offline. I’d like to have that functionality with WO Code. Are the sites we create & edit stored in “the cloud” or on our desktop? Thank you!

Stacey Foster
Stacey Foster

Thank you for putting this out there. You answered so many of my questions. Can’t wait for the launch! You all are life savers.

Pete Smithies
Pete Smithies

Thanks for your article, very interesting reading.

Like Jeannette, I too have paid a lot of money for lifetime hosting space and so require the ability to host externally. I have started to look at Webflow – which, as stated in your article (the steeper learning curve aside) offers much and more than what you are proposing. I have stalled on “diving in” whilst I investigate the limitations (eg forms and dynamic content) external hosting will present. I look forward to reading your comments on hosting issues.

Regards

Pete

Virginia Bledsoe
Virginia Bledsoe

Thanks! You are a Godsend!

MuMarvin
MuMarvin

Do it! You can build it… We trust you!!

Bruce Barham
Bruce Barham

I am not a “developer” genius. I’m just a not-so-talented pseudo-developer with a personal blog/textual content based religious research site that I’ve had for over 17 years and which I hope to keep and enhance indefinitely. I recently scrapped a WordPress based site built by an ex-developer “partner” who knew that platform very well. I did so because I hate WordPress and had very little experience with it. I deleted that WordPress version and TOTALLY rebuilt my site using Muse as recently as February (yes – less than 2 months ago). I had some previous experience with Dreamweaver then Muse as the development tool prior to my traitorous partner leaving me high-and-dry with a site I couldn’t properly maintain. The impending death of Muse was a severe gut punch to my future site management plans. It is profoundly good news for me to know you’re “on the case” and developing a superior product and site development procedure. You can be sure I’m sticking with you guys. Your work, support, and general “can-do” customer focused attitude sold me and is now keeping me. Thanks! (By the way, it is likely that Adobe will loose me as a multi-year Creative Cloud subscriber since Muse was the primary reason I subscribed to CC.)

Tracy
Tracy

One last comment…please consider making sure that we can redirect via “a” record and that the ssl will still be able to work….my clients don’t like services taking over their domains….

Judy
Judy

I too like Jeannette and Pete have spent a great deal of money with my hosting company and can host as many sites as I wish for no extra payment. I have to more and more compete with large companies such as wix and godaddy etc and my client base want more control of their site so my major profit exists in ongoing hosting fees I can collect from the sites I build rather than the design itself.

My important needs are for customers to be able to make their own changes and for it to be more flexible than inbrowser editing as this is limited. Also for my sites to be hosted on my own server. If this is not possible I will have to see what else is available. I do appreciate the work you have done and love the widgets you created for muse, I don’t mind a learning curve, there have been many since the days of frontpage and I am sure there will be more in the years to come.
Thanks again, Judy

Donavan Bill
Donavan Bill

…love it.

Natasha Walker
Natasha Walker

Thank you all for what you are doing. I started web design with Serif Webplus about 9 years ago, even though I can code and have a degree in all of that I hated Dreamweaver. I just wanted to knock out a website and move onto the next. Then they quit on us which caused me to move to Muse. I figured out all of Muse and then they quit on us. I really hope you all are in it for the long run. In either way though, thank you for informing us and sticking by your clients by meeting our needs as they come… few companies do that!

Chris | Brown Sparrow
Chris | Brown Sparrow

You guys are my guarding angel

rene
rene

Hello Steve,
I do this in Dutch because my english is not so good.
You can translate with google.
Ik heb alles gelezen via google translate. Ik ben al lang een trouwe gebruiker van jullie en kan niet wachten tot het nieuwe platform er is. Mijn steun heb je en ik hoor tegen die tijd wel wat de prijzen zullen worden.

Kind regards
Rene

Egan
Egan

Really looking forward to W/O Code and cloud-based web design with Architect! Thanks y’all.

John
John

Steve – Thank you for the insight to be pro-active and helping us from all leaping off the bridge.

I echo so many other comments on here . . . I too have a dedicated server, pay a monthly fee and host all of my current clients on it. If I use WithoutCode to create a new website or update an old website, I would be taking a paying client OFF my server and be forced to move them to your individual domain hosting plan – effectively now paying double to keep my own client while still maintaining my server for my old clients.

I understand the hosting dilemma, you are faced with as it pertains to your cashflow – but that same dilemma will now exist for all of us who currently already own/lease a fixed cost hosting solution of their own. Please consider this FTP export option from WithoutCode that so many of us out in the web design world are counting on.

Again, thanks for the insight and the forethought of stepping up to create a Post-Muse environment. Kudos to you and your team.

Martina Lotter
Martina Lotter

Thanks for the update. I am also concerned about cost ie hosting, membership etc. Many of my clients wanted their sites hosted at GoDaddy etc. what would happen now if I were to redesign their sites in Without Code and they want to keep their sites at their preferred hosting platform. Many of my sites use the Muse Themes Widgets such as Ecwid, Mumblr and would like to know if it will be supported in Without Code.

Ken Frazer
Ken Frazer

Thanks for your support Steve. I think you have struck a good balance in complexity vs ease of use with this choice. I look forward to working with it when its ready. Kudos to the well written FAQ – it really gives many of us a better understanding of how this kind of software and support has to work to be viable.

Muki Venture
Muki Venture

But when and how much it cost? we need to make decisions.

Joe Martinez
Joe Martinez

Steve – the thing I admire and respect is your honest and proactive mindset. I am excited about Without Code and can’t wait to get my hands on it. Of everything you have let us know, this is perfect for what I need. Great Job so far!

Dawn Gray
Dawn Gray

There is one question that I have that I did not see an answer to. Is your new platform going to upsale every single add on element such as Wix, Square Space, and WP does? Most online site builders charge for every single extra thing you want to add i.e. if you need to ad more than one form to your site, the app provider gets to put their name on the site unless you upgrade and pay a subscription. That’s why I dislike on line cookie cutter, prefab site builders. It gets expensive every time a client wants to add a feature and they have to pay for it, they go somewhere else. I’d rather code or use Bootstrap or Dreamweaver before I have to buy every little widget on a site.

Studio-ODS
Studio-ODS

Thanks for the FAQs and the future plans for the new WO/C. This isn’t the first time Adobe abandoned a product and it’s loyal “slaves”. Anyone recall Adobe GoLive? It was on the same path as Muse however it didn’t get near as far in development. I think it was a product ahead of its time. Adobe bailed and left users with Dreamweaver as the only option. You say Dreamweaver is a red-haired child of the family with no love for by Adobe but it continues to exist.

Your commentary made me think, perhaps, Adobe saw the same thing — they can’t compete with cloud-based apps and decided to can it. Who knows, maybe they resurrect it at some point as a new product (Like GoLive to Muse – I tell you it was very similar) and it becomes a cloud-based software.

For now, I wish Adobe would sell the product and BC Hosting to another company. Of course, that’s not going to happen, and, inform their customers about it.

One feature I’d like to see added to the list is with the forms. The inclusion of a similar CRM database that collects the names/info for email campaigns. Oh, and the email campaign feature similar to BC Hosting. It was so great having it all one package.

Fonta
Fonta

I’ve just canceled my cloud subscription even thou I was charged a cancelation fee, but I am very happy now. As a multimedia artist, I’ve been using photoshop, premiere pro, After effect, muse, and InDesign for a very long time and paying lota money for it. now I move to Apple final cut pro, motion 5 etc doing and very affordable. I am really struggling to trust any Adobe product at the moment and will never trust again. I am currently hosting all my website with Ipage and they also got a fantastic website builder and a good price. I am just waiting for WC pricing.. only then i will decide if i move to them or not . but i wll wait to see how stable WC is before making that move. no trust anylonger

John MacPherson Allan
John MacPherson Allan

Thank you Steve as always you explain things so well! I can’t wait for Without Code to launch as I can hold off my new clients for a bit it makes sense to wait. cheers John

Claudio
Claudio

Thousand thanks for your profound explanations, Steve. I am looking forward to W/O Code. Will it be possible to upload .oam files? Would like to showcase my animations and microsites made with Tumults Hype. Can’t wait to host and rebuild my website on W/O Code.

Tinxz
Tinxz

Could it be possible to buy Muse with all of us? So that we all are shareholders … and you guys from MuseThemes keep refining Muse? It’s such a damn shame that a app like Muse would get lost…

Muki Venture
Muki Venture

I’ve just canceled my subscription with musetheam and adobe. I’ve moved all my accounts to (ipage) and using their web builder tools. I am happy now with the new platform. will never wanna go that adobe road again.thats how frustrated and agree I am. since week ago, Steve promises us magic but when is that going to happen and how can we trust that we not going to be left in a limbo-like Adobe

Jozef K.
Jozef K.

Timeframe? I need to make decision. You or webf… . Thanks for reply.

steve
steve

Hi Steve. can u pls update us on what is going on? we need to make decisions and clients cant keep waiting for forever.. when is this stuff ready?

Kathy
Kathy

How much more do we still have to wait. can you update us?

Leif Reinholdt Mogensen
Leif Reinholdt Mogensen

Hi guys at Musethemes and Without Code.
I have watched the teaser movie about Without Code. It looks very interesting – especially Architect. Like many other members, I would like to be informed about a schedule for launching the Without Code including price setting. Is it 1 week, 3 weeks, 1 month or ….? Please inform us about the time of release.

Vincent Buell
Vincent Buell

With your wocode hosting plan, will email accounts also be made available?

art ward
art ward

I have over 20 sites currently hosted under one hosting package.

Will your packages on offer facilitate multi domain hosting under one package?

Art

Steffi
Steffi

Hi Steve. Can you pls respond to all questions? We need urgently answers. How much more do we still have to wait. Our clients need answers from us

Steve Harris
Steve Harris

Hi Guys – please head over to our WOCode facebook group. We’re sharing information there, and many users are already working with the new app (beta). Here’s a link: https://www.facebook.com/groups/292693001288573/

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